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best outliner you use? (2018)

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Posted by Jon Polish
Apr 23, 2018 at 01:30 PM

 

Although I would encourage learning IQ (it really is that good), have you looked at AllMyNotes? It may satisfy your needs. And, it is a Windows program with installed and portable versions.

Jon

cicerosc wrote:
I am very concerned about seeming overly critical about Infoqube because
>it is clear that Pierre has poured a lot of his life into it, and if he
>achieved his goals for himself then it is not for me to state that “my”
>goals are different from his.
> >It appears to me that Pierre sees Infoqube as one massive database
>within which to pour all his data and then manipulate it in as many ways
>as possible.
> >That is a very different goal than those of us who simply want a capable
>single-pane outliner with an advanced subset of Ecco-like features.
> >To me, the great unaccomplished potential of Infoqube in my outlining
>world is what MyInfo and Rightnote and similar programs lack - Both (1)
>A RICH TEXT single-pane outline (for example, on the left of the screen)
>combined with (2) a RICH TEXT long-form “word processor” type pane (for
>example on the right).  Ecco always had rich-text single pane outlining,
>but it never had a viable long-form rich-text “notes” field, despite the
>efforts the EccoExt programmers, and other addons (MagicView?) to
>accomplish that.  I see this combination as my “holy grail” of being
>able to write detailed rich-text outlines while combining each “node” in
>the outline with supporting text, graphics, links, spreadsheets, etc -
>all the data that support the point made in the particular outline mode.
> Yes I can do that to some extent on MyInfo, Rightnote, and the other
>dual-pane outliners, but their “outline” is nothing more than a
>primitive ASCII “task list” format that barely deserves the name of
>outline,  (And in fairness, they call themselves “information managers”
>so their outlines are not really outlines at all, just hierarchical
>lists.
> >I personally can live with non-standard idiosyncrasies like calling the
>main working field a “GRID” rather than a “workspace” or some other
>user-friendly term (Does “grid” have a better ring in Canada, or is it a
>subliminal reference to “this is an SQL database and don’t you dare try
>to make it into a word processor!” ;-)  )
> >But what I personally am able to live with is one thing, vs factors that
>limit the program’s usability to a much larger user base, which is a
>factor that rings a “caution” bell before investing too much time in a
>particular program. 
> >Against all apparent odds Pierre has marched forward for **years** in
>building this program, and he deserves tremendous credit.  And it is
>absolutely no demerit to Pierre if his everything-database concept is
>not our goal as outliners.  But I note also that Pierre has constantly
>participated in this forum, and the Ecco forums, over the years, so it’s
>also clear that outlining is of value to him. 
> >That’s why it’s so frustrating—the basic tools are there in Infoqube,
>and if they could just be refined and brought to the surface he’d have a
>real contender.  He’s probably already got the most CAPABLE outliner on
>the market - what he doesn’t have is the most USABLE outliner. 
> >That’s why I’ve invested time in these comments and think that it would
>be helpful for others to do the same.
>

 


Posted by Pierre Paul Landry
May 2, 2018 at 06:33 PM

 

Jon Polish wrote:
> Although I would encourage learning IQ (it really is that good) (...)

cicerosc wrote:
(...)
> Against all apparent odds Pierre has marched forward for **years** in building this program, and he deserves tremendous credit. (...)
> He’s probably already got the most CAPABLE outliner on the market - what he doesn’t have is the most USABLE outliner. 

Thanks to both you !

That does indeed describe it quite well (“Against all apparent odds Pierre has marched forward for **years**”)... yeah… years…

But the destination is within reach now, especially with the just released v108 which brings many usability improvements, namely:

- New: “Welcome to InfoQube” command and IQBase: The Welcome IQBase is a system provided and managed IQBase designed to help users learn how to use InfoQube
- New: Workspace: New Tab button, to create new outlines or open existing ones
- New: Calendar: View and Edit Google Calendar Repeating events
- New: Grid: Add Column command: Button to create New Fields (on the fly, without going to the Field Properties dialog)
- New: Grid: Improved drag / drop (UI and speed). This makes IQ a viable option for Kanban-style information management (i.e. Trello-like)

With 32 new features (and nearly as many bug fixes) included in v108, it’s time to update the documentation now…

Details here:
http://www.sqlnotes.net/drupal5/index.php?q=node/4145

Pierre Paul Landry
IQ Designer

 


Posted by Paul J. Miller
May 2, 2018 at 09:44 PM

 

Stephen Zeoli wrote:
On the other hand, I still think the best outliner remains Tinderbox. I
>wrote about the reasons here:
> >https://welcometosherwood.wordpress.com/2015/04/22/outlining-with-tinderbox-6-6-2-to-be-precise/
> >And the app has only gotten more powerful in version 7. I don’t use it
>every day because it is only available for MacOS.
> >Steve Z.

I agree that from what I have seen and read in the documentation Tinderbox seems to be the best outliner around but I cannot use it because there is no Windows version.  They keep saying they are working on a windows version but it never seems to get any closer to becoming a reality.

I do have a chronic case of CRIMP and so I have bought most of the available note taking programs.  The two I actually use for day to day organisation are ConnectedText and MyInfo.  It would be nice to have a go with Tinderbox for Windows.

 


Posted by Chris Thompson
May 3, 2018 at 12:56 PM

 

My guess is that Tinderbox for Windows is currently on ice. The developer restructured a lot of the code a couple of years ago to make Windows development easier, but he doesn’t appear to be focusing on that any more. There are now some plugins for Tiddlywiki that can handle some of what Tinderbox does, although the visual-oriented ones tend to slow down with any realistic number of notes. Queries and actions (like Tinderbox agents/edicts) are generally ok with larger numbers of notes in Tiddlywiki if you can figure out what to do, but I don’t have any Tiddlywiki project with more than about 500 notes.

—Chris

Paul J. Miller wrote:

>
>Stephen Zeoli wrote:
>On the other hand, I still think the best outliner remains Tinderbox. I
>>wrote about the reasons here:
>>
>>https://welcometosherwood.wordpress.com/2015/04/22/outlining-with-tinderbox-6-6-2-to-be-precise/
>>
>>And the app has only gotten more powerful in version 7. I don’t use it
>>every day because it is only available for MacOS.
>>
>>Steve Z.
> >I agree that from what I have seen and read in the documentation
>Tinderbox seems to be the best outliner around but I cannot use it
>because there is no Windows version.  They keep saying they are working
>on a windows version but it never seems to get any closer to becoming a
>reality.
> >I do have a chronic case of CRIMP and so I have bought most of the
>available note taking programs.  The two I actually use for day to day
>organisation are ConnectedText and MyInfo.  It would be nice to have a
>go with Tinderbox for Windows.

 


Posted by Donovan
May 5, 2018 at 07:30 PM

 

Jon Polish wrote:
Although I would encourage learning IQ (it really is that good), have
>you looked at AllMyNotes? It may satisfy your needs. And, it is a
>Windows program with installed and portable versions.
>

Hi Jon, I honestly am not sure if there’s a touch of sarcasm in your response to user cicerosc?
AllMyNotes is about as far as you can get from IQ. From one extreme to another. AMN, in my opinion, has a user interface best suited for primary school children— with its cutesy icons and colors.
I actually had a license for my 12 year-old and ran into problems with a licensing issue that was so petty on the part of the developer that it ruined it for me and my child. Again - IN MY OPINION - it’s very childish in presentation and developer communication.

 


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